Trump has vowed to pardon the January 6 rioters. Allies and critics alike say he needs a refresher | Real Time Headlines

Washington—President-elect Donald Trump’s Recent Meet the Press interviews The massive investigation into the Capitol attack that has resulted in hundreds of convictions in the nearly four years since Jan. 6 has raised concerns among allies and critics about how well he understands the details.

Trump is weeks away from being sworn in, a day he has said he will “probably” immediately begin pardoning the January 6 defendants. “I would focus on J6 as early as possible, maybe the first nine minutes,” Trump Tell Time magazine. “We’re going to look at each case and we’re going to deal with it very quickly and within the first hour of my administration. The vast majority of these people should not be in jail.”

Interviews with Trump allies, supporters of the Jan. 6 defendants, cyber sleuths assisting the FBI investigation and law enforcement officials reveal an unusual level of agreement: Trump’s recent comments made it clear to them that he is not keeping up. latest progress. More than 1,500 defendants have been charged, 1,100 have been convicted, and more than 600 of them have been sentenced to prison in the sprawling investigation into Capitol breaches. Throughout 2024, defendants were arrested, convicted, and sentenced, but the cases were reported less and less.

Trump told NBC News’ Kristen Welker that he would “move quickly” on pardons on Jan. 6, saying there could be one if the Jan. 6 defendants were “radical” or “crazy.” “exception”. He also appears to have mistakenly believed that most or all of the January 6 defendants were in jail in Washington, when in fact only one A few defendants remain in pretrial detention Those convicted are now in federal prisons across the country. One law enforcement official said the interview made it “absolutely” clear that Trump did not understand the details of the January 6 case.

A Trump ally familiar with discussions within his team said the “Meet the Press” interview showed the president-elect’s blind spots in the massive investigation.

“More specific and updated arguments need to be presented to the public to defend the pardons of the defendants on January 6,” the Trump ally said. “The Washington jail is just one aspect of the process of locking up hundreds of J6 employees who have been sentenced.”

“Even people familiar with the day-to-day prosecutions of J6 have a hard time keeping up with what’s going on. But it’s important for the president to provide a very concise and compelling argument for these pardons,” the Trump ally said.

Another person with direct knowledge of the Trump transition team’s plans said their understanding was to select a few defendants who were “very worthy of pardon” rather than granting blanket pardons to most participants, but that the process would continue for weeks. and a few months to review the rest. Another source familiar with the discussions said they expected Trump to issue large-scale, widespread pardons, but there was no indication he had gone through the details. The Trump transition team had no comment.

Ed MartinA Trump ally said the conservative activist whom Trump recently appointed as chief of staff at the Office of Management and Budget was widely involved in discussions for the Jan. 6 pardon. Martin is a board member of the Patriot Freedom Project, a group that provides support for the Jan. 6 defendants and their families and has hosted fundraisers at Trump properties. Martin was also at the Capitol on Jan. 6, although there was no evidence he entered the restricted area, and he spread conspiracy theories, including one about a man he dubbed “Mr. Coffee” after the attack. Conspiracy theories. Martin, who supported Trump at a fundraiser for the defendants on Jan. 6 last year, did not respond to a request for comment.

Lawyer Bill Shipley, who represents numerous clients, said on January 6 that Trump would have to “go big” on the pardon issue “to deliver on campaign and post-election statements” and said he was “feeling” about the pardons. Optimistic” although he saw no sign that a formal process had been established.

“It seems to me that the scope of the pardons or commutations that are going to be implemented after January 20th will be quite broad,” Shipley said. “I have not seen any information that the mechanism for handling these pardons has been decided.”

Among the defendants involved in the January 6 case were rioters, who were shown on video waving or using gun, stun gun, flagpole, fire extinguisher, bicycle rack, batonone metal whip, office furniture, pepper spray, bear spray, tomahawk, an ax, hockey stick, knuckle gloves, bat, Huge “Trump” billboard, “Trump” flagone fork, block, crutch and Even an explosive device More than 140 police officers were injured in the brutal attack.

Steve Baker, January 6 defendant He is now a writer on Glenn Beck’s “The Blaze” and plans to sentence Trump once he takes office, telling NBC News he’s well aware that Trump is busy building his administration.

“I’m not trying to be critical at all. What I’m saying is considering all the other things he has on his hands right now… the one thing he doesn’t understand is the actual details of the January 6th case,” Baker said. “Not everyone is sitting in the Gulag in Washington, D.C. right now. … It’s clear that he doesn’t know the individual cases. He knows pieces of the story, like most people do.”

Epps was the 16th person whose photo was added to the FBI’s Capitol violence website during the chaotic early days of the investigation, and his photo was quickly identified and then removed from the site. This sparked conspiracy theories that Epps was a federal informant, based on the premise that Epps was accidentally added to the list and then removed. (Many of the conspiracy theories emerged from crowds on January 6 that included members of the mob accuse If their Trump supporters weren’t secret federal agent Or members of Antifa, a left-wing group involved in violent protests.

“What happened to Ray Epps? Now, I don’t know anything about Ray Epps, but there’s something strange about the way he talks,” Trump said in the interview. “Where is he? What happened to him?”

The answer: Epps is on federal probation. Epps is charged Implemented by the Department of Justice in 2023, and plead guilty One count of disorderly or disruptive conduct on limited grounds. federal prosecutor Seeking six months in prison for EppsThey said it was justified because of his efforts to “motivate and rally crowds” to storm the Capitol. a federal judge Give Epps a suspended sentencestating that Epps was “defamed in an incident unique to the defendants on January 6” and was the only defendant on January 6 who “suffered for something you did not do,” and that given the incident’s Collateral, ‘No need for jail’ conspiracy theories about Epps’ life.

Epps said at a January sentencing hearing explain He now realizes that the 2020 election “was not stolen” and that the violence was “created by people like me who support President Trump and listen to his lies and the lies of others” that the election was stolen. Epps said the targeting of him by his fellow conspiracy theorists was a wake-up call.

“It’s life-changing, it’s a life-changing reality check when Fox News and the Trump wannabes turn to me and my wife to conveniently deflect blame,” Epps said during the sentencing hearing. “I “My wife and I were forced to look elsewhere for the truth.”

A Trump ally told NBC News that while “the Ray Epps thing is exciting to the public,” it’s not a coherent argument for why Trump should pardon the Jan. 6 defendants. “Overall, this is not a compelling part of this much needed political and public debate,” the source said.

This isn’t the only conspiracy theory Trump has repeated in interviews.

Trump also said there were “probably some people from Antifa” in the crowd on January 6 “because those people seemed to be in good shape.” Many of the January 6th participants were mistakenly identified as anti-fascist protesters and were arrested and disclose A former Trump supporter, though an “anti-establishment” activist is currently serving a six-year prison sentence for what prosecutors say was “inciting anarchy”.

Trump also said video evidence was being hidden from the public. “You have a lot of cameras. They don’t want to release the tape. They don’t want to release the tape,” Trump said. Indeed, the Justice Department regularly releases evidence videos from the January 6 case at the request of media coalitions, and the Republican-led committee released thousands of hours of CCTV footage from January 6 on the conservative video-sharing site Rumble. .

An internet sleuth who has helped the FBI arrest hundreds of people told NBC News that 90 people currently on the FBI’s Capitol violence website have been identified and reported to the FBI but have not yet been arrested. Fifty-nine of them were listed by the FBI as “AFOs,” meaning wanted for assaults on federal law enforcement, and nine were listed as “AOMs,” meaning wanted for assaults on the media. A law enforcement source told NBC News last month that investigators would focus on “most shockingThe case continued until Trump took office on January 6. Since then, seven “AFOs” have been arrested, as well as 10 defendants whose photos do not appear on the FBI website.

One internet sleuth said Trump’s comments were “a rehash of the oldest internet conspiracies” but joked they did agree with Trump that House Republicans should release more of the January 6 video , as some of the most critical footage was never uploaded.

Another detective said Trump’s arguments didn’t appear to have much internal consistency.

“He was angry about the arrests of people who did not enter the Capitol. But he also wanted to know what happened to Epps. He promised to pardon everyone who was arrested. Like Epps, he was charged and sentenced , but did not enter the Capitol, they said. Ahhhhh”.

Within the Justice Department, there is frustration over the pending pardons but pride in the work done by the Capitol Siege Section. Even if Trump pardons hundreds of defendants on January 6, the reality of the attack cannot be erased.

“You can’t ring the bell for a conviction,” a federal prosecutor involved in the Jan. 6 case told NBC News. “No one can take that away.”

Prosecutors are determined to pursue their work until the end, regardless of whether Trump-appointed Justice Department officials order a halt to the investigation or the five-year statute of limitations expires in 2026, sources said.

“The mood has changed, but our morale is far from gone,” they said. “We will ride this train until the end of the line, whether that is January 20, 2025, or January 6, 2026.”